Vroom!

fatalifeaten · Post by **fatalifeaten** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 10:56 pm

Don't know how many performance freaks we've got over here, but I though I'd share what I did this weekend.

One of my brother club members from the Ventura CA area hand delivered me a set of 40mm Kadrons yesterday for Clyde (6+ hours to Phx) . I slapped them on last night, got the car put back together to the point where it would fire and idle(poorly), and then decided to tune this morning. I'm running a 1641 that is almost bone stick, just an 009 and a generic empi small flange 3 bolt header and baffled stinger.

10 minutes of idle and mix tweaking, a little water on the street at 9 am this morning and a nice burnout into third gear.

I love my car

This is my first experience with dual carbs. I was expecting the usual headaches of tuning and synching, but it literally took me 10 minutes to dial them in. The balance tubes on the manifolds for Kadrons make all the difference.

If you want to play around with something that will bolt in over the course of an afternoon and completely change the way you drive, I'd highly suggest picking yourself up a set. Try and find some nice older ones at a swap meet and rebuild them, I've heard the newer empi ones aren't as reliable as the OG kads and the early brosols. You can find them in good shape in the 3-400 dollar range, and anything under 250 is a steal.

elkluvadore · Post by **elkluvadore** » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:26 pm

In my opinion, dump the twins, according to the book "how to hot rod your vw" it sounds like you've over carburated your engine, its probably killing gas mileage too. Thats my 2 cents

empiracer1966 · Post by **empiracer1966** » Sat Aug 16, 2008 2:14 pm

WOW, Cool!!

I have just re-read your post, realizing that I just got a set of "CHERRY" vintage 40mm kadrons, intakes and all (just missing the center linkage) for $75 bucks!!

I got them for, one...the price, two...the price, after pricing a new set, three...the price and thought it would be a good pick for my 1641, w/moderate valves, porting and sporting an engle 100 cam!

Now I cannot wait to try-em out!

I ordered new air cleaners and 2 rebuild kits from CB just incase they need 'em.

This motor is going behind my "full race" transaxle so I can show no mercy...Like I said...I can't wait!

Brian

fatalifeaten · Post by **fatalifeaten** » Mon Aug 18, 2008 12:14 pm

elkluvadore wrote:In my opinion, dump the twins, according to the book "how to hot rod your vw" it sounds like you've over carburated your engine, its probably killing gas mileage too. Thats my 2 cents

I disagree. I'm getting 26 mpg in town from these carbs after tuning them to this engine. Not 28-31 as with a 34 pict3, but pretty darn good. Checked them with a wideband AFM too. A tiny bit lean at idle, but the rest of the range was beautiful. I'd call that pretty efficient, not over carbeurated.

Empiracer1966:

You'll notice a change over a stock carb for sure. What jets do you have in? I had to change mine because I dropped in a 110 cam, and I'm running a 135 main and a 45 idle. your 100 might run a little lean on that idle jet because the overlap difference so you might try a 50 idle and see how it's doing.

empiracer1966 · Post by **empiracer1966** » Mon Aug 18, 2008 10:26 pm

fatalifeaten...

I didn't even tear apart the carbs yet to know what jets are installed and I just got the rebiuld kits this past weekend.

This is a new avenue for me (aircooled carburation)...you seem to know a little more then me in this dept. and I welcome your input. Thanks! I am wondering though about my altitude verses yours along with climate...any input?

Brian

fatalifeaten · Post by **fatalifeaten** » Tue Aug 19, 2008 10:14 am

The idles are actually on the outside, on the sides. You can pop the tops to get to the mains, they're in the bottom of the float bowl.

Do yours have chokes on them? Bless you if they do, they'll make PA winters less frustrating. Otherwise, make sure your jacket's warm while you're bumping the throttle to keep teh car running until it warms up

What's your elevation there? Phx isn't too high, My house is about 1400 feet above sea level (which is actually higher than I thought) If you've ever heard of "basin and range" geology, we're the first basin.,.

Depending on the altitude (and the shift), you're probably going to need to go leaner. How much will depend on how high you are.

As for the conditions,... Not too sure what you might need to adjust in the winter You're probably going to have to fiddle with it a bit if you expect to drive it in the cold. I'll admit to a lack of experience winterizing, it's headline news-worthy if we go below freezing

http://lowbugget.com/ will give you a lot of info about setting up kads. One thing AJ really emphasizes is fuel pressure. K-Dogs really like to have 1.5-2pis and they'll get really grumpy with more than that. It's nice, because a stock mechanical pump can handle that easily. You'll need to check the fuel pressure (you can get a pressure gauge at pretty much every auto parts store and/or sears/harbor freight/etc). I had to shim my mechanical a bit to get it to 1.8PSI

empiracer1966 · Post by **empiracer1966** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 7:55 pm

fatalifeaten

Here at work...I just tore down one of the carbs (the right side one). The carbs really looked good on the outside and what I could see in the venturies, but the inside is another story!

the float was literally varnished fast to the bottom of the bowl and the jet was all but smoothed over with it also. All the small holes had been plugged with bug nests (this is quite common 'round here in carbs that were left sitting for a long time). It did clean-up well though. And to think, I was gonna just bolt 'em on !!

The "idles, the jet on the outside" is a 57 and the "mains the jet on the inside" is a 27...alot smaller then what you're using

As for chokes...no, they don't have them...I do know all about starting a performance engine in the cold months w/o a choke(the "bumping the throttle" part) for my old flame was a '69 Chevelle with a 355ci w/13.5:1cr that went 11.36et at 119mph, and I drove it everywhere all year round...just had to pump the snot out of it till it was warmed up...Damn! I miss that car!! all that power!! Eventually, I would like my '66 to go just as quick and fast

just don't tell the wife...

Brian

fatalifeaten · Post by **fatalifeaten** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 11:32 pm

Hmm... I',m wondering if that's a 127 instead of a 27. I've never heard of a 27 main jet. I've never heard of a 57 idle either, but heck, anything's possible if they're older, right?

What size venturis are in them?

Don't know of you've done this yet, but most parts stores have "carb dip" in gallon cans. Junk's AMAZING. Overnight soak, some air, and nice clean carbs. Wear rubber gloves though, the solvent's kind of caustic.

You're going to want to check the throttle assemblies for wear. You can buy an entire replacement throttle section (the lower section) for pretty cheap if they're questionable.

... Btw, nice to see you spell your name the right way.

--Brian

empiracer1966 · Post by **empiracer1966** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 11:46 pm

fatalifeaten

The venturis are the stock size...28

Just how do you set the needle an seat on these carbs? The float arm might have gotten bent while cleaning,

now i'm not sure if the "bend" is correct...I know thats how you adjust the n/s on some carbs, by bending the mounting arm.

Brian

fatalifeaten · Post by **fatalifeaten** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 1:45 pm

Take the other one apart and compare the float arms. I've actually got mine out right now as I had a main bearing let loose and I'm waiting for a cam, so if you need me to I can pull the top off one and take a pic. I haven't had to replace the needle and seat in mine, so I'm not sure yet. Did a quick google and don't really see anyone talking about a specific procedure either. Here's teh only useful tidbit I found:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=213801

empiracer1966 · Post by **empiracer1966** » Fri Aug 22, 2008 6:06 pm

OK...I got the other carb apart last night...the floats appear to be ok...now, I'm wondering if I just figured out why some animals eat there young!

While dissassembling the left carb, over all, it appears that someone was trying to be a carb tuner

miss matched bolts, the needle and seat was missing the washers alltogether, neither carb had a filter (which would explain why there was actually metal shaving like chips in the idle jets), and the jets do not match carb for carb...idles or mains!

On the right carbs' jets, there is a #57 on the idle and a #27 on the main and on the left carbs' jets there is a #g65 on the idle (yes, a lower case letter g) and a #130 on the main, both of these jets in the left carb has "solex" also stamped on them...guess I'm gonna call 'A.J.' and order a set of jets, fuel and air filters now and maybe even their alum. throttle linkage...Ca-CHING!

Brian

fatalifeaten · Post by **fatalifeaten** » Sat Aug 23, 2008 2:13 pm

heh. Guess you know now why you got such a good deal on them.

when you order your stuff, get several jets. Odds are you're going to have to tweak them a bit. Ask AJ what he thinks is a good starting point for your climate and altitude, and then get maybe 1 step richer and 2 steps leaner's worth of jets for mains and idles. I'm thinking 130 main and 45 idle might actually be a good start, but double check it with him. Make sure you get those filters back in, they make all the difference. I still think you might want to drop them in some carb dip and clean them out, especially since they're obviously not consistent. Start your rebuild with nice clean parts, and swear less later from gunk clogging you up.

AJ can set you up with a good bellcrank linkage too. This is what I run (though admittedly not his, mine came with the scat linkage), and I'm very happy with them. The stock linkage stinks. Almost impossible to correctly sync and the ball sockets snap off. A lot of people give up on the kads because they can't get them dialed in right, and it's because of the crappy linkage.